Thread: Blackmagic Pocket Cinema 4K Camera

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  1. #811  
    Senior Member Taikonaut's Avatar
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    We probably see third party battery grips with a slot for external hard drive
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  2. #812  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asyndeton View Post
    What cinema cameras have image stabilization?
    Nobody has been smart enough to do it yet, but it'll come; it's inevitable, just like AF and now DPAF - once you try it, you're unlikely to go back if you shoot handheld. For some, it will be a downside (when current IBIS implementations are turned off, the sensor still wobbles around a bit). Someone will figure out a way to lock them down in that scenario, too. The argument that "no cinema camera has ever had that" is tired and weak. We didn't have digital cameras before, and now we do. we didn't have raw capable cameras before and now we do. Technology advances, and nobody is going to make you use a feature you don't want. Single operators are already benefiting immensely from great AF and handheld operators will kill you and everyone you know for IBIS.
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  3. #813  
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    Complaints about this camera at this price point are definitive proof that humans are wired to NEVER EVER EVER EVER be satisfied.

    I hope the Juicebox magic power will work with it, because I suspect the battery life will stink.
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  4. #814  
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyger11 View Post
    Nobody has been smart enough to do it yet, but it'll come; it's inevitable, just like AF and now DPAF - once you try it, you're unlikely to go back if you shoot handheld. For some, it will be a downside (when current IBIS implementations are turned off, the sensor still wobbles around a bit). Someone will figure out a way to lock them down in that scenario, too. The argument that "no cinema camera has ever had that" is tired and weak. We didn't have digital cameras before, and now we do. we didn't have raw capable cameras before and now we do. Technology advances, and nobody is going to make you use a feature you don't want. Single operators are already benefiting immensely from great AF and handheld operators will kill you and everyone you know for IBIS.
    That is true. A few years ago in-camera memory format was sneered at as "unprofessional" by some and the same people are now devoute in-camera formatters.
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  5. #815  
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbp View Post
    Complaints about this camera at this price point are definitive proof that humans are wired to NEVER EVER EVER EVER be satisfied.
    That is why there is progress. If humans are easily satisfied we be still using box browne.
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  6. #816  
    Senior Member Asyndeton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyger11 View Post
    Nobody has been smart enough to do it yet, but it'll come; it's inevitable, just like AF and now DPAF - once you try it, you're unlikely to go back if you shoot handheld. For some, it will be a downside (when current IBIS implementations are turned off, the sensor still wobbles around a bit). Someone will figure out a way to lock them down in that scenario, too. The argument that "no cinema camera has ever had that" is tired and weak. We didn't have digital cameras before, and now we do. we didn't have raw capable cameras before and now we do. Technology advances, and nobody is going to make you use a feature you don't want. Single operators are already benefiting immensely from great AF and handheld operators will kill you and everyone you know for IBIS.
    Exactly, the technology isn't there, if it's noticable at all, no proper DP will want it. And I much prefer the natural feel of hand-held operation, with a proper rig you shouldn't need image stabilization in-camera.
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  7. #817  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asyndeton View Post
    Exactly, the technology isn't there, if it's noticable at all, no proper DP will want it. And I much prefer the natural feel of hand-held operation, with a proper rig you shouldn't need image stabilization in-camera.
    With IBIS, you don't need a full heavy rig. Not all solutions are appropriate for every situation or user. This is not the right industry for Luddites.
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  8. #818  
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyger11 View Post
    Nobody has been smart enough to do it yet, but it'll come; it's inevitable, just like AF and now DPAF - once you try it, you're unlikely to go back if you shoot handheld. For some, it will be a downside (when current IBIS implementations are turned off, the sensor still wobbles around a bit). Someone will figure out a way to lock them down in that scenario, too. The argument that "no cinema camera has ever had that" is tired and weak.
    Everything you say is fine and we are all for progress, BUT I think you need to read between the lines of what Darren is saying.
    It’s not about Cinema Cameras not having IBIS because they never have before. It’s that you’re wanting to put “Photo Camera” tech into a Cinema/video camera that in no way could be beneficial. And would actually cause more problems than solve.

    The amount of correction you get from IBIS is only really good enough to steady your shaky hands while filming your bros at their most recent wedding venture. Or making sure your Eiffel Tower group video, which is being shot by some radom weirdo you handed the camera of to, comes out smooth.
    It can’t in anyway what so ever compette with multi axis gimbals or steady cam. Not even close!

    On top of that, most reports of trying to use it while mounted with a gimbal causes IBIS to act eracct and unusable.
    Yes, would we want IBIS that could replace gimbals someday? Of course! But micro movement of a sensor left to right and up and down isn’t cutting it.

    So what Darren is saying is , ‘Why would I try to cram a shifting sensor into my multi thousand dollar Cinema camera, only to have to leave it turned off cause it can’t perform the way I need it to, and cause me other headaches because it’s in there?’

    Anything being done handheld in Cinema seems to be done shouldered mounted. Anything needing complex movement, steady cams and gimbals are used. And anything where you need to stand still and remove “Hand Jitters” then IBIS works wonderfully. The later is just not really a called for shot in cinema I don’t reckon.

    I hope it advances to gimbal level steadyness some day though. That would be sweet!
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  9. #819  
    Senior Member Asyndeton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyger11 View Post
    With IBIS, you don't need a full heavy rig. Not all solutions are appropriate for every situation or user. This is not the right industry for Luddites.
    I agree you actually, I'm not close-minded and would welcome it, but realistically, there is no in-camera stabilization that is fit for cinema-use available. That's why no cinema camera has it, when the technology is there, then yes let's see what it can offer for creative story-telling. But to stabilize something in-camera while it's being shot in real-time would require a very powerful camera for cinema-usage and probably years away from that being usable if anyone is even working on creating it. That's why I think it's unfair to nitpick this camera for not having it when there are no other products that do for its intended use. If you can present a video example of something that has IBIS and perfectly stalibilizes hand-held footage and still looks natural then I'll admit I'm wrong and be impressed. IBIS is great for still photography usage, I don't see any personal use for it beyond that.
    Last edited by Asyndeton; 04-13-2018 at 12:12 AM.
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  10. #820  
    Senior Member Asyndeton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timothy Cook View Post
    Everything you say is fine and we are all for progress, BUT I think you need to read between the lines of what Darren is saying.
    It’s not about Cinema Cameras not having IBIS because they never have before. It’s that you’re wanting to put “Photo Camera” tech into a Cinema/video camera that in no way could be beneficial. And would actually cause more problems than solve.

    The amount of correction you get from IBIS is only really good enough to steady your shaky hands while filming your bros at their most recent wedding venture. Or making sure your Eiffel Tower group video, which is being shot by some radom weirdo you handed the camera of to, comes out smooth.
    It can’t in anyway what so ever compette with multi axis gimbals or steady cam. Not even close!

    On top of that, most reports of trying to use it while mounted with a gimbal causes IBIS to act eracct and unusable.
    Yes, would we want IBIS that could replace gimbals someday? Of course! But micro movement of a sensor left to right and up and down isn’t cutting it.

    So what Darren is saying is , ‘Why would I try to cram a shifting sensor into my multi thousand dollar Cinema camera, only to have to leave it turned off cause it can’t perform the way I need it to, and cause me other headaches because it’s in there?’

    Anything being done handheld in Cinema seems to be done shouldered mounted. Anything needing complex movement, steady cams and gimbals are used. And anything where you need to stand still and remove “Hand Jitters” then IBIS works wonderfully. The later is just not really a called for shot in cinema I don’t reckon.

    I hope it advances to gimbal level steadyness some day though. That would be sweet!
    Well put, I'm not very good at explaining things and not trying to come off an elitist jerk, there's just a reason why it's only in still cameras. Though benefiting gimbal usage to get rid of tiny jitters and vertical bounce would be amazing!
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