Thread: Is The Kinefinity Terra the Camera URSA Mini 4.6K Should Have Been?

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  1. #1 Is The Kinefinity Terra the Camera URSA Mini 4.6K Should Have Been? 
    The Kinefinity Terra 5k has 15 stops of dynamic range just like the UM 4.6k, similar resolution of course, has switchable Rolling Shutter and Global Shutter like the UM 4.6k was supposed to have, and it's about 1/3 the weight and size!

    The Dynamic range is 15 stops in rolling shutter mode and 13 stops in global shutter mode. So basically it matches Blackmagic 4.6k's dynamic range in the equivalent rolling shutter mode and is 13 stops in global shutter mode making it one stop more than Blackmagic's 12 stop global shutter 4k sensor in a body size and weight that about 1/3 of Blackmagics!

    As far as framerates it can do 5k up to 60fps and 4k up to 100fps and can shoot in all the Prores flavors including cineform RAW and their own Kineraw (KRW) format. Goodness...

    Another huge thing for me is the Kinemount which is being described as a sub-PL mount which gives it enough flange distance to mount all of the popular lens mounting options: PL, EF, and Nikon. Since I all of my lenses are Nikon mounts this was very intriguing to me and when looking into their Nikon mount I saw that the nikon lens mount option that they offer has a declicked aperture ring built in! They also offer an enhanced Nikon and EF mount which is a focal reducer just like the popular Metabones Speedbooster.

    They also sell a 16 stop of dynamic range 6k version which shares the same sensor as their previous 6k camera known as the Kinemax. This sensor can do only do rolling shutter mode with no global shutter option at 6k up to 25fps and 4k up to 100fps. What is interesting is that it can only perform at 16 stops of dynamic range in 3k mode and 14 stops of dynamic range in all the other resolutions. This makes me more excited for the 5k model because I wouldn't really shoot in the 3k mode so I most likely wouldn't put the 16 stops to use. However I would use the global shutter mode on the 5k making the 13 stops in that mode very enticing since I love the dynamic range of my Pocket and Cinema Camera and when I want more dynamic range I can always switch to rolling shutter mode and enjoy 15 stops of dynamic range.

    Right now I have to bring my URSA and production camera to a shoot since I don't fly my URSA due to weight and most of the time I actually fly my pocket vs my production camera because of weight so it will be nice to have a camera like the Kinefinity so that I can bring one camera to do all the different types of shots and have the ability to switch between rolling and global shutter at a price point that is no more than the UM 4.6k.

    I'm really contemplating this purchase especially since Blackmagic seems to be keeping us URSA owners in the dark with their latest plans, which goes against what they promised URSA owners.

    PRICE:
    Kinefinity 5k for $5k (Shipping Late June)
    Kinefinity 6k for $6k (Shipping Late May)

    What do you guys think???
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  2. #2  
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    Some cons:

    - no internal ND (Blackmagic doesn't have them either, you have to go for ARRI, Sony or Canon for that)
    - the form factor is not my cup of tea. I used a mirrorless camera for a while and got tired of rigging it up and down
    - modularity is another thing that I don't like. It's the same as with RED - the camera is 5k... oh, you want XLR? Buy this brick for 2k. And at some point you realize that the camera didn't actually cost 5k, but actually 18k
    - probably no downscaling for Prores, only windowed/cropped
    - speaking of that, do they even have a license for Prores?
    - on EOSHD I read that they are still working on the switch between rolling and global shutter - sound familiar?
    - if you don't happen to live in China, you'll pay even more because of shipping, taxes, duties and so on
    - QC, build quality, reliability, usability are all question marks. The menus look bad, IMO. If and when they have problems like all other manufacturers, what will happen? Even Blackmagic is still building their reputation when it comes to quality, customer service, fixing things, release patterns etc. Kinefinity is not on the same level as Blackmagic, yet, let alone Canon and Sony. What if the camera is an unreliable POS and you need to send it to China every few weeks?
    - speaking of reputation, some people will hire you just because you have a RED or Canon C300 or Sony FS7, but nobody knows about Kinefinity. If this matters to you, it's something to consider (doesn't matter to my business)

    I'm intrigued about the 5K version. I need to see footage, read reviews from trusted sources and try it myself, but it could be pretty rad camera if everything works out the way they say.
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  3. #3  
    Senior Member DPStewart's Avatar
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    Check back in a year and we'll see if the KINI cameras have panned out.

    What they really look like, and what they really cost.
    Last edited by DPStewart; 04-20-2016 at 03:29 PM.
    Cameras: Blackmagic Cinema Camera, Blackmagic Pocket Camera (x2), Panasonic GH2 (x2), Sony RX100 ii, Canon 6D, Canon T2i,
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  4. #4  
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    Yeah man.
    The title to this thread only makes sense if you own a time machine.
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  5. #5  
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    When they get a established US marketing team that can build a decent website, promote the camera properly, and offer a quick answer to questions as well as instilling confidence in getting the camera repaired. Basically I'd need an all around kind of confidence from a expensive purchase one would normally get then I'd consider it.
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  6. #6  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kastel View Post
    ...including cineform RAW...
    That was previous gen Kinefinity. No mention of Cineform in the Terra specs.
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  7. #7  
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    The Kineback looks relatively inexpensive and provides a ton of functionality. You've already got hdmi out and mini trs audio input on the brain. If you want to go big get the kine back and get a ton of functionality in a single module. Thats's one of the things I didn't like about the craft renders, every option is an additional module, I can see that camera getting big pretty quickly.
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  8. #8  
    Quote Originally Posted by DanChevalier View Post
    Some cons:

    - no internal ND (Blackmagic doesn't have them either, you have to go for ARRI, Sony or Canon for that)
    - the form factor is not my cup of tea. I used a mirrorless camera for a while and got tired of rigging it up and down
    - modularity is another thing that I don't like. It's the same as with RED - the camera is 5k... oh, you want XLR? Buy this brick for 2k. And at some point you realize that the camera didn't actually cost 5k, but actually 18k
    - probably no downscaling for Prores, only windowed/cropped
    - speaking of that, do they even have a license for Prores?
    - on EOSHD I read that they are still working on the switch between rolling and global shutter - sound familiar?
    - if you don't happen to live in China, you'll pay even more because of shipping, taxes, duties and so on
    - QC, build quality, reliability, usability are all question marks. The menus look bad, IMO. If and when they have problems like all other manufacturers, what will happen? Even Blackmagic is still building their reputation when it comes to quality, customer service, fixing things, release patterns etc. Kinefinity is not on the same level as Blackmagic, yet, let alone Canon and Sony. What if the camera is an unreliable POS and you need to send it to China every few weeks?
    - speaking of reputation, some people will hire you just because you have a RED or Canon C300 or Sony FS7, but nobody knows about Kinefinity. If this matters to you, it's something to consider (doesn't matter to my business)

    I'm intrigued about the 5K version. I need to see footage, read reviews from trusted sources and try it myself, but it could be pretty rad camera if everything works out the way they say.
    I hear you. Fortunately the Kineback which gives the unit XLR audio, V-lock mount, SDI connections, DC outputs and sync connections is only a $1200 add-on which to me is still great! so $6,200 is still not bad considering we are getting the global shutter option, interchangeable mount, and lower weight/size. The ND has never been an issue for me since I prefer to use my own choice of ND's as internal ND's may or may not have the quality/color that I want or need for specific looks/tone. Also modularity is huge especially when it is 1/3 the size which means you can build it the way you want it and it will most likely still be the same if not smaller than the UM46. You could also store it that way like I do with my pocket so you don't have to rebuild it everytime. The pocket is one of the most popular cameras for the reason that it can be built up or down depending on the shoot. Personally would rather have the option than not.

    I love blackmagic cameras which is why I own so many of them, but I am glad there is a company out there who can challenge them at this performance to price ratio that seem to hit all the points that I am looking for. Everyone's needs are different for sure and I am just glad to see that such a camera even exists as it can only help the other manufacturers become more competitive.

    The Kinefinity 6k Sensor has been out since last year and there are quite a bit of footage on the web that I've been checking out and I must say I actually like the look.

    Here is a link to the NAB 2016 interview if anyone wants to learn more about it with me:
    http://www.newsshooter.com/2016/04/1...rra-6k-for-6k/

    Also, this is what the 6k sensor will look like on the Terra 6k since it's the same sensor in their Kinemax 6k camera:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcgewofpsMc
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  9. #9  
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    I like what Kinefinity is doing, and on paper the tech specs are awesome. The actual image just isn't that impressive (considering that they are using the same existing sensors as their other cameras). The Ursa Mini's color IQ just blows Kinefinity out of the water. Though I feel that the motion cadence in both cameras are lacking.
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  10. #10  
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    It's too early to tell for sure, but the existing 6K sensor looks pretty damn filmic to me. This is purely a matter of taste, but I'm not entirely thrilled with the color rendition I'm seeing off the UM46K. it's a very modern look, appealing to many, I'm sure. but it's a little too... digital looking for me. Perhaps vintage glass will curb that. But back to the Kinefinity Terra models, I like having the option of adding the Kineback as well as their speedbooster option which brings you close to full frame if you want it. i've got money set aside for an URSA Mini 4.6k but hitting pause until I see what the Terra 5K sensor looks like in a few months.
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